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Piledrivers part deux *UPDATED*

There’s a whole bunch of talk about piledrivers lately. First you’ve got Nate Marquardt dropping Thales Leites on his head, and the debate over if it was intentional or not. Now people are bringing up Dong Hyun Kim dropping Jason Tan on his head (a move I’m calling ‘The Dongdriver’) and wondering where’s the outrage on that one.

Well, the difference between Dong and Nate is pretty straight forward: Nate is popular and Dong is not. Plus, Marquardt dropped Leites on his head in an attempt to finish the fight because he was losing on the scorecards. Dong spent the entire fight whupping Tan across all eight sides of the octagon. While that doesn’t excuse the head drop, it certainly makes it seem less sinister and prickish.

But let’s talk for a moment about intentional and non-intentional spikes: They’re both liable to put a person in a wheelchair for life. With both fighters, everyone is wondering “Was it on purpose or was it an accident?” Let me ask you something: do you think Leites or Tan would give a shit either way if they had been paralyzed because of it? Dropping a guy on his head is 1000 times worse than an eye poke or a kick to the groin. Regardless of if it was intentional or not, you still fucking did it and you should get disqualified for it.

**UPDATE** I’ve changed “But let’s talk for a moment about intentional and non-intentional piledrivers” to “But let’s talk for a moment about intentional and non-intentional spikes”. The reason I do this is because everyone is busy arguing over whether Dong’s move was a piledriver or not. Jeez people, you’re missing the point (PS: it was a DONGDRIVER!!!). Regardless of what wicked cool pro wrestling nickname applies, getting dropped on your head is insanely dangerous – like end of your career dangerous. Like ‘Darn, I was really looking forward to using my legs while raising my children’ dangerous.

50 COMMENTS
  • i piledrove myself once while using a trampoline and while my neck hurt for a few days i’m ok now. How many people have been paralyzed via piledriver? Fedor seemed to survive his alright.

  • smoogleton says:

    If you’re saying Dong should’ve been DQed you’re a moron. He tried to turn Tan over, who stubbornly held onto the leg, causing Kim to lose balance.

    Congrats on representing the worst of the whiny, knee-jerk MMA “fans” out there

  • Smitler says:

    I still don’t understand how you can “unintentionally” pick someone up and drop them on their heads!?!
    Accidental eye-poke or groin kick I get.

  • j says:

    I agree with smoogleton. Looks more like he fell forward because Tan was holding on for dear life.

  • godzillad says:

    Unlike back of the head shots, eye pokes, and groin strikes, there is not one fucking chance in hell that you can ”unintentionally” spike someone on their head.

    #2 is a dumbass. I bet he thinks it’s OK that little kids are killed in drivebys because ”it wasn’t intentional”.

    Yeah, because the intention is what separates murder from manslaughter.

  • RL Dookiefuck says:

    Piledrivers kick ass, I can’t believe there’s a controversy there.

    so do drivebys

  • smoogleton says:

    “#2 is a dumbass. I bet he thinks it’s OK that little kids are killed in drivebys because ”it wasn’t intentional”.”

    Wow thats some airtight logic right there. Too bad it wasn’t even a piledriver.

  • ninjitsu says:

    Not only was that not an *intentional* pile driver by Dong, I don’t think it was a piledriver at all: Dong grabs him by the thigh/crotch and is trying to toss him, but Tan holds on to an ankle and so Dong stumbles forward and falls to his knees. Tan’s elbow and Dong’s knee hit before Tan’s head hits the mat.

  • Fatal Error says:

    Marquardt intentionally tried to spike Leites in order to finish the fight. He should have lost via DQ then and there. Dong tried to pick up his opponent and reposition him and was thwarted when his leg got grabbed. Intent makes all the difference when it comes to moves like these.

  • i don’t even think tans head touches the canvas but landed on his own arm

  • Stellar53 says:

    Funny you were talking about piledriving your cousin in the low blow. When I was about 10 or 11, I piledrove my cousin and I knocked him out for a good 10 minutes. He was breathing but he was fucking out. I seriously thought about running away for good. Luckily he woke up and didn’t have a clue what happened. I told him he fell and hit his head on the coffee table and I got away with it…..for a couple years that is.

  • I personally think the referees simply aren’t familiar with it, which speaks volumes to the standards and training that MMA refs are currently required to have.

  • vinhthekid says:

    dong’s obviously NOT piledriving tan.

    for fuck’s sake, you can see tan holding on for dear life and causing the position, how you call that a piledriver i have no idea. dong has NO fault in this, and if he was DQ’ed it would’ve been a travesty.

  • godzillad says:

    Tan holding on to Kim’s leg has nothing to do with his lower body being lifted over his head now does it?

    Tan is physically incapable of landing on his arms. They are around Kim’s left leg.

  • if you look his face makes contact with his own hands, that were holding on to Dongs legs.

  • kwagnuth says:

    If he wasn’t trying to pile drive him then what was he trying to do smell his balls or something.

  • Jackie Chiles says:

    Hehe “Dongdriver”

    I agree with Amy, I think that the refs know way less about the actaul rules than we give them credit for…which is really saying something.

    The abritrariness of refereeing in MMA needs to be fixed immediately if the mainstream is going to accept it. Granted, there will always be some judgment calls but there need to be more specific standards for these guys to follow so some big dumb ass isn’t out there stopping fights when they shouldn’t be stopped or not stopping fights when they should be stopped.

  • Kid Nate says:

    Who would’ve expected FL to turn into the nagging little old lady of the nets? And all this without HT’ing BloodyElbow for inspiring (yet another) post.
    Plus what I’m really pissed about is you ignored my olympics & mma post this morning which would’ve led the old Fightlinker to an investigation and expose of turkish oil wrestling.

  • ajadoniz says:

    i can tell you why no one is making a big deal out of this one, it’s because ITS NOT A PILEDRIVER.

  • Jersey Tomato says:

    Yeah, it definitely appears that Tan landed not on his head but on his elbows and that Dong was moving forward with his weight and then stumbled on account of Tan having a lock on his right leg.

    I think we have flogged Fightlinker sufficiently on this one, unless of course he refuses to admit he is dead wrong. His premise of his argument is sound however. Piledrivers are dangerous and should be cause for DQ. No one would argue that with a straight face. I am glad Stellar53’s cousin was not seriously injured and that their lives were not forever altered due to some innocent horseplay. Marquardt, on the other hand, is a professional athlete and should know better.

  • godzillad says:

    Ryan, you can go through that GIF frame by frame and show these retards that Jason does not land on his arms but with the full brunt on the crown of his head.

    My god man, if Dong Hyun Kim was Diego Sanchez you guys would be ready to lynch.

  • Garth says:

    the one thing no one’s copping to here is exactly what kim was trying to do. what technique would involve lifting your opponent straight up and down like that? was he trying to flip him on his side? that seems unlikely. he lifted the man straight up, took an awkward step (it looked like he was thinking of doing something else, but who knows), then went down to his knees. he obviously didn’t attempt to violently spike him, but WHAT was he doing? i can’t tell.

  • smoogleton says:

    godzillad, you have no idea what you are talking about. Lifting up a fighter from their hips like that is perfectly legal, and doesn’t automatically mean you are thinking piledriver (duh). Kim was trying to flip Tan over his own right hip, and obviously Tan was physically capable of landing on his arms, all he had to do was let go of the single leg. Instead he didn’t, which gave the first glance appearance that Kim was possibly going for a piledriver; on further inspection, he obviously wasn’t.

  • Looks like Dong was trying to flip Tan onto his back using a thing called leverage.

  • godzillad says:

    It doesn’t matter what the fuck you guys think Kim was TRYING to do because the bottom line is he was responsible for dropping Jason Tan on the top of his head.

  • but to me his head never made contact with the mat and even if it did it was from a distance of like 12 inches with a guy holding him back.

  • MMAStation says:

    Tan even said in an interview after the fight that he doesnt think he was trying to spike him and that it actually felt like once it seemed like he would land on his head Dong “Kind of set me down”

    If the guy fighting doesnt think it was wrong then I dont know how we can say it is.

  • ^couldn’t have said it any better myself.

  • godzillad says:

    ”If the guy fighting doesnt think it was wrong then I dont know how we can say it is.”

    That’s the most retarded goddamn logic I have ever read in my life.

  • what the fuck are you high? he was a participant so who would know better than him? Somebody writing on a forum looking at a gif image?

  • godzillad says:

    Randy also thought he headbutted Gonzaga. Yoshida also said Royce was unconscious. Gomi also said Azeredo was still fighting back. My point is shut the fuck up with that stuff because you aren’t anything at all close to lucid during a fight and you barely know what the hell is going on.

  • MMAStation says:

    “That’s the most retarded goddamn logic I have ever read in my life.”

    If he had said ” i wasnt knocked out” or ” I dont think the fight should have been stopped” and I said that then I would agree it was retarded logic.

    However, when the guy who was being “piledriven” agrees that it was:

    A. him grabbing the guys leg
    B. He was set down, not slammed

    Then I would have to agree with fighter on that one.

  • no one was being punched in the face so i think his memory would be pretty accurate for that point of the fight

  • MMAStation says:

    ” My point is shut the fuck up with that stuff because you aren’t anything at all close to lucid during a fight and you barely know what the hell is going on.”

    By that logic we shouldnt ask any fighter anything about a fight, because they wouldnt know wtf happened.

  • Garth says:

    slap fight! slap fight! slap fight!

    http://tinyurl.com/5ftsfo

  • where ryan when you need him

  • MMAStation says:

    probably putting on anti burning asshole cream.

  • vinhthekid says:

    if you look, that’s a highcrotch grip, not a grip around the hips which would be normal for a piledriver. as a wrestler, i’ve seen people flip people over for the pin just like dong tried to do.

    he was doing a legit technique and then tan’s response caused him to fall forward, the head MAYBE hitting the floor. no responsibility by dong. no dq. this is a contact sport, if tan had gotten injured, it would’ve been an accident and his fucking fault.

  • Okay, I’ve changed “But let’s talk for a moment about intentional and non-intentional piledrivers” to “But let’s talk for a moment about intentional and non-intentional spikes”. The reason I do this is because everyone is busy arguing over whether Dong’s move was a piledriver or not. Jeez people, you’re missing the point (PS: it was a DONGDRIVER!!!). Regardless of what wicked cool pro wrestling nickname applies, getting dropped on your head is insanely dangerous – like end of your career dangerous. Like ‘Darn, I was really looking forward to using my legs while raising my children’ dangerous.

  • tophw says:

    getting dropped on your head is like fucking Christopher Reeve dangerous man. seriously ban that shit.

  • Some guy says:

    Should we also include Alan Belcher’s front flip with Okami hanging on his back? That looked pretty dangerous to me….

  • cyrus says:

    Whatever, that was unintentional. To you whiny “accident or no accident, dq him” people – suck my dick, bitches. This is fighting, not fucking pottery making. Jesus, you moron jackals make me sick sometimes. Is this Sherdog? Morons. How about if you kick a guy so hard in the side of the leg that he flies sideways and lands on his neck? Head drop! Head drop! DQ! That’s a retarded analogy? So is saying that this was Dong’s fault and he should be DQ’d. DQ gravity? you fucking retards, your moms would have done that shit cuz their titties look like slop now – not possible, fuckers.

    Fuck all of you fucking morons, especially fightlinker for the bad call and godzillad – just because he molests his kids.

    Eat a dick.

  • cyph says:

    ^”Is this Sherdog?” says the guy in a paragraph littered with fuck, fuckers, fucking, morons, suck, bitches, and molesting kids.

  • The rule does not make a distinction between intentional or unintentional. Look it up. It merely prohibits spiking an opponent on his head — it makes no difference at all if it was on purpose or accidental or whatever, just like it makes no difference to the guy who gets paralyzed whether it was intentional. It’s prohibited either way.

  • godzillad says:

    ”The rule does not make a distinction between intentional or unintentional.”

    Neither does your broken neck.

  • smoogleton says:

    lol what a meaningless distinction. Tan didn’t get spiked

  • RL Dookiefuck says:

    People who are worried about being able to use their legs shouldn’t be getting into the octagon with Dong Hyun Kim.

  • Tommy says:

    Now that’s some real talk. They should stop the fight and allow the other fighter a chance to recover at the least. If it is severe enough, stop the fight and DQ the offender.

  • G_hoppa says:

    There is no way he should have been dq’ed for that. It is tans own fault. If he wanted to avoid a possible head spike, he should have went with the roll over. But by planting his weight the other way, he knew the risks he was putting on himself, and opted to chance it instead of giving up a position. How you can dq a fighter for the opponents actions is beyond me.

  • cyrus says:

    rat a tatt ttaat

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